“People who take on the role of a CHIS may place themselves at considerable risk, while their continued co-operation is of great importance to the effectiveness of investigation and law enforcement work. All organisations have a responsibility to protect the identity of individuals working as CHIS, and others who may be affected by the disclosure of the CHIS’s identity. Organisations using CHIS should attempt to protect the identities of CHIS by all reasonable and lawful means possible and where appropriate by neither confirming nor denying the existence or identity of a CHIS.”
“To state that a person is an agent would be likely to place him in immediate danger from terrorist organisations. To deny that he is an agent may in some cases endanger another person, who may be under suspicion from terrorists. Most significant, once the Government confirms in the case of one person that he is not an agent, a refusal to comment in the case of another person would then give rise to an immediate suspicion that the latter was in fact an agent, so possibly placing his life in grave danger… If the Government were to deny in all cases that persons named were agents, the denials would become meaningless and would carry no weight. Moreover, if agents became uneasy about the risk to themselves being increased through the effect of Government statements, their willingness to give information and the supply of intelligence vital to the war against terrorism could be gravely reduced. There is in my judgment substantial force in these propositions and they form powerful reasons for maintaining the strict NCND policy.”
“Lurking just below the surface of a case such as this is the governmental policy of ‘neither confirm nor deny’ (‘NCND’), to which reference is made. I do not doubt that there are circumstances in which the courts should respect it. However, it is not a legal principle. Indeed, it is a departure from legal norms relating to pleading and disclosure. It requires justification similar to the position in relation to public interest immunity (of which it is a form of subset). It is not simply a matter of a governmental party hoisting the NCND flag and the court automatically saluting it. Where statute does not delineate the boundaries of open justice, it is for the court to do so.”
“(1) There is a very strong public interest in protecting the anonymity of informers, and similarly of undercover officers (UCOs), and thus of permitting them and their superiors neither to confirm nor deny their status; but it is for the court to balance the public interest in the NCND policy against other competing public interests which may be applicable… … (3) Even where an individual informant or UCO has self-disclosed, the police (or the Secretary of State) may nevertheless be permitted to rely on NCND in respect of allegations in the case where to admit or deny them might endanger other people, hamper investigations, assist criminals, or reveal police operational methods.” (Emphasis added)
“…for an NCND policy to be effective in ensuring that information is not revealed about individual cases, the NCND response must be provided invariably. This is not a novel point: it lies at the heart of the NCND policy as it is, and always has been, applied by the security and intelligence agencies.”
“11… During those discussions in June 2020, MI5 neither confirmed nor denied whether or not this individual was a CHIS, role-player or otherwise. However, MI5 did explain that running aspects of the story relating to this individual would cause damage to national security. MI5 asked that those aspects be removed, and Mr de Simone agreed to remove them…”
“On8 June 2020 , I received a call from a representative of MI5 and went on to have several conversations with him. I have read the account provided by ‘Witness A’ of these conversations. It does not correspond with my recollection in various respects.”
“The relevance of the detail of the exchange is hopefully clear. The engagement between MI5 and the BBC in June 2020 was effective in neutralising the risk that had been presented. If during that engagement MI5 did indeed [GIST: depart from NCND], then the justification for withholding that information from the Defendant in connection with the present proceedings in [sic] significantly weakened (and arguably falls away altogether).”
“In the event, that option was not pursued – and NCND was maintained in the discussions which then took place, as detailed in Witness A’s confidential witness statement… Whilst there is no contemporaneous note of the discussions in June 2020 between MI5 and the BBC, it is evident that NCND was maintained because: 1) Had there been a departure from NCND… that departure would have been recorded. 2) The BBC have not stated that [GIST: there was a departure from NCND].”
“(i) Were any notes (or other record) ever made by MI5? (ii) If notes (or other record) were made, why do they not now exist? (iii) If notes (or other record) cannot be found, what searches have been carried out? (iv) Would it not be expected/good practice that notes of such calls would be made, as in December 2021, particularly given the possibility, which had been contemplated, that MI5 would need to [GIST: depart from NCND]? (v) Is there any other contemporaneous (or near contemporaneous) record of the detail of the engagement in June 2020?... If so could we be provided with any such record? (vi) In the absence of contemporaneous notes, how / on what basis is Witness A able to state that ‘during the course of those discussions in June 2020, MI5 neither confirmed nor denied whether or not this individual was a CHIS, role-player or otherwise?’ (vii) If not relying on his own knowledge, on what records did Witness A draw to make that apparently categorical statement? (viii) With what degree of confidence can Witness A make that statement? (ix) Was Witness A the person from MI5 who spoke to Daniel De Simone in June 2020? (x) If the answer to (ix) is ‘yes’, why does Witness A not say so in terms in either his OPEN or CLOSED statements?... (xi) If the answer to (ix) is ‘no’, or if others within MI5 spoke to Mr De Simone, in addition to Witness A, could all those who did speak to Mr De Simone make witness statement(s) setting out their recollection of the conversations?”
“a. Paragraph 3(i) and (ii) – no notes or other records were made by MI5 in respect of the June 2020 meeting. b. Paragraph 3(iii) – no specific searches have been completed in respect of the June 2020 exchanges because the individual at MI5 who spoke to the BBC in June 2020 has confirmed that no notes or other records were made.”
“We are satisfied that there is cogent evidence before us to support the Respondent’s assessment as to the harm to national security of waiving NCND, in addition to that of identifying X. We also do not accept that the Respondent has come close to waiving NCND in its approach or conduct in reply to Beth’s allegations. Rather, the respondent has gone to extensive lengths throughout these and the BBC proceedings to uphold the NCND policy.”
“The OPEN Report concludes that there was no deliberate attempt on the part of MI5 to mislead, or lie, about what transpired in the course of the Officer 2 Conversations. The inaccuracy in Witness A’s evidence (and the subsequent responses to the Special Advocates) arose from the fact that no contemporaneous record was made of telephone discussions which resulted in Officer 2 having to do their best to remember, many months later, what was said based on an imperfect recollection and inference from the surrounding circumstances.”
“Like Sir Jonathan, I am unable to identify any advantage that would have accrued to MI5 by giving incorrect evidence concerning the Officer 2 Conversations. On the contrary, the events leading up to the conversations, including the authorisation to depart from NCND if necessary, only served to emphasise the seriousness with which MI5 was treating this issue and the extent of the risk we had identified should X be identified as a CHIS.”
“The multiple calls that took place between me and Person B were a sustained departure from NCND. Person B departed from NCND in every substantial telephone conversation we had, some of which lasted as long as 40-45 minutes. The departure from NCND was not a small detail in a limited conversation during which Person B quickly achieved his aim of persuading me not to refer to X in my reporting; on the contrary it was a series of lengthy conversations in which a significant amount of detailed information about X was discussed and shared. [Officer 2] called me specifically to depart from NCND: telling me that X was a CHIS was the method that [Officer 2] used to try to convince me not to include X in the upcoming broadcast.”
“I have considered whether the new BBC material suggests an additional motivation for Officer 2 to lie or obfuscate about his calls with the BBC – because they provide evidence of wider disclosures. My terms of reference state that it is not for me ‘to make findings about why specific individuals did or did not do certain things’. Serious though Officer 2’s failings no doubt were, I note the finding of the internal investigation that he has been open and honest with them throughout the process. In any event, even if (contrary to the findings of the internal investigation) Officer 2 had deliberately lied about the content of his calls with DDS when it came to the production of evidence for the High Court, as mentioned above there is no evidence that others within MI5 connived in any such lie or set out deliberately to mislead the court.”
“If the court considers that a contempt of court (including a contempt in the face of the court) may have been committed, the court of its own initiative shall consider whether to proceed against the defendant in contempt proceedings.”
“If there is further action that the Court considers to be necessary, or further information that needs to be provided, then that will be done.”